[dazzer-b]

my mate has got a civic type r which beats me everytime in acceleration and top speed. acceleration is mainly due to it red lining at 9000rpm im doing well until i change gear. then if im in front doing about 120 with my foot down he will fly past. i have a 1998 agu, jabba induction kit and am looking at getting my car re-mapped my upsolute or if need be jabba with the addition of the ko3s.

will an upsolute remap on its own do the trick at both acceleration and top speed. if not will the jabba option. no biast opinions please im only 20 and cant afford to get it done if its not going to wipe a big smile off my mates face.

cheers

 

[djhorace]

Think a remap might close the gap but the 1.8t guys will know better.

 

[Chris]

I doubt it, the Type-R is a very very quick car... and the rev range throws out of the window normal BHPvsBHP arguments. In a Golf, i would expect you'll need upwards of 220-230bhp to match one.

I drove one back to back with a 225bhp Leon Cupra R, and the Type-R was quicker than that even.

I do question your reasoning behind a remap if its only to beat yer mate....

 

[EddyH]

Just the upsolute may not be enough although it'll be close. With a K03s, exhaust and remap you should beat him on acceleration but I still think you'll struggle with top speed from my experience of owning a CTR and K04'd Golf.

 

[turbo paul]

i don't have any trouble with Civic or Integra Type Rs. if you get the ko3s with a jabba remap you shouldn't have a problem either. Go for it! but only if you can really justify the outlay its not worth getting in to too much debt just to beat a mates car.

Edit to say that it was pretty even between me and my mates teg until i had an exhaust and cai fitted. So as EddyH said get an exhaust as well.

 

[simch]

Yep, Eddy H is right, a K03s remap and exhaust will be enought to just about match a type R on outright performance pretty much......but you will then kill one in day to day driveability, as you will not have to rag it as much a as a type r! Its a nice sensible conversion, the k03sport/jaba map.

I'm not far off so amybe next meet at the Fleur de Lys in H Wycombe (see Rich "R1 GTI" for details!!) I'll take you out in mine for a try out.

 

[dazzer-b]

yeah that sounds good i only live about 3 mins away. cheers mate cant wait

 

[GaryM]

I have had four traffic light grand prix's now on dual carriageways with CTR's, same story every time - we are pretty much level until im halfway through second gear then I start to pull away.

I have been up to speeds of 130 (KM []) and they havent even threatend me.

 

[Mike-P]

My PD150 whupped a Type R and I didn't realise we were having a race! When he found out it was a diesel he nearly cried.

 

[micky 32]

high revs dont mean anything as such, its just the power band is higher so for a given speed say over the golf there will be just more noise from the civic so im guessing if the civic is at 5000 rpm its probably doing nothing.

i had a link where there was a play between a tuned seat leon PD150 and a civic and all you could hear was revs from the civic and at 8000 rpm and it wasnt hardly gaining on the diesel and that only revs to about 5000 rpm! so really revs arent everything its gearing also.

 

[Mike-P]

Micky's right, the Civic develops 200bhp but only about 145ft lb of torque at 5900rpm, that's less than half of what my PD150 produces from 2200rpm.

Even in standard trim the PD150 produces 236ft lb at 2100.

 

[Tim Sims]

Quote: posted by Mike-P on 22/12/2004 21:58:23

Micky's right, the Civic develops 200bhp but only about 145ft lb of torque at 5900rpm, that's less than half of what my PD150 produces from 2200rpm.

Even in standard trim the PD150 produces 236ft lb at 2100.

Why do people always jump on the bloody torque band wagon???? Of course its about bhp on a drag!!! Torque in the higher rpm's is what is gonna give you your peak bhp figure.... and thats where you genrally are in a 'race' type situation. All this low down nonsense gets right on my t##s somethimes.... blah blah blah

[/rant]

[B)][]

Oh and as some have said a upsolute will not be enough to keep with him imho. You wont be far off, but not close enough to upset him either.... you need to be holding better boost in the upper rpms but the regular ko3 simply can't []

get a ko3s and map with exhaust and you should be fine.

 

[marriedblonde]

Bl00dy hell boys you all have some very fast machinery!!!!

 

[shane]

I don't understand - doesn't the CTR put out 200bhp?? So why would a chipped 1.8T which should put out 200bhp (according to Revo) be much slower than a CTR? Is the CTR that much ligher than the golf?

Anyway this is chalk and cheese if you ask me cause the CTR needs to be revved hard to see the power and it will kill the golf in the bends BUT (won't) the golf kill the CTR in real world driving (thanks to the excellent midrange particularly after chipping not to mention its sweet leather recaro's)? My 1.8T is standard and I know I've suprised a few people in more "exotic" machinery - can't imagine how much fun it's gonna be when I get the arb's fitted and Revo in January []

 

[micky 32]

this thread wasnt about torque but revs. just because a ctr has 8000 rpm doesnt mean its quicker it means you have to rev the **** out of it.

 

[Felix]

Actually - in my opinion, unless the CTR is in V-Tec range (6k toward 9k), then you would have a fair match even with a stock PD130 - have a look at this power curve (torque and BHP) for a civic type R (there is a modified one on there too).

http://www.hondata.com/k20a2euroctr.html

The standard Type-R is showing about 130BHP and less than 120ft/lb at 6000RPM.

After that point, then Id give up. Unless of course it was up a steep hill, then I may still try it.

In fact, if you look at below 5.5k, the power trails off rapidly, personlay I like the fact that I can drive round town at low revs (2k), and still have the power should I need it, drive round town in the Type R and you have to drop it one or two pegs to make quick progress.

As far as handling and an all out race, then you need a pretty well specced golf to match a TypeR, but catch one out of Vtec, and you can have em' with just about anything.

Oh and then theres the quality of the interior - so we cant beat em' in a race, but while the lap round the track may take us longer, we dont have to spend the time in a plastic bubble.

edit - oops forgot the link - now added

 

[Martyn]

Good thread guys.. I have a guy challenge me everytime he sees me in the R...

But I dont need to have a go... Cause my Cars so pretty, pretty, pretty... LOL...

 

[Richard W]

Quote: posted by Chris on 22/12/2004 18:41:59

....I do question your reasoning behind a remap if its only to beat yer mate....

Me too, if all you want to do is beat your mate then buy a faster car...[]

If, on the other hand, you want to improve your golf then listen to these guys, what they've forgotten about Golf tuning is more than most folk will ever know!

 

[Chris]

Most people who comment on a Type-R seem to never have driven one. There are far from lifeless below 6000rpm.... and it's actually quite pokey.. it's certainly 150bhp 1.8T equivalent at lower revs. No turbo remember, no waiting for boost to raise its head.

And driven properly, it is a ferociously fast car... and the noise is brilliant, and the gearbox is just about the best you will get in ANY car. I personally couldn't live with it day to day (why i didnt buy one), but on a thrash out, it'll be more fun than a 1.8T, that i have no question. It makes you drive and use an engine properly.. not be lazy and rest on the torque.. which whilst effortless, takes away some of the thrill IMO.

 

[micky 32]

you have to remember too that just say you had 2 cars accelerating at the same rate say from 60 to 100. one car is at about 5000 rpm and the other is at 8000rpm, the one at 8000rpm with the roar of the engine is going to give the illusion its accelerating faster.