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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Anyone been following this on the news?

Would like your comments. She taught in a normal public school, wearing her vale. Her managers asked her to remove it, she wouldnt. In the end, she had her three strikes and got dismissed. Now shes sueing, has already had a payout for 'hurting her feelings' and is taking it further. It's on the news a lot.

She is saying it does not effect her teaching and that we should all intergrate. The managers etc are saying 'well intergrate and take it off', she says thats racism. So, shes now getting paid out for us not intergrating and watching the news last night, looks like she might get a big payout.

She lost her case against the school for discrimination and harrasment (asking her to take off the vale), yet get's a small payout. Shes now taking it further.

Is this good news? Or bad news?

I think it's good, showing her and others around that intergration is NOT all one way. We seem to finally be taking a stand.

For more info: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6069012.stm
 

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It's good news that she lost the case. I have no problem with Muslim women wearing veils, although I do find them quite intimidating and hard to communicate with someone wearing one. I think people who wear a veil will just have to accept the consequences that come with covering your face. This goes for ANYONE covering their face, by whatever means, and is not directly about religion: people covering their faces will have to accept that there are certain jobs that they will not be able to do, such as teaching, police etc etc, while there are still lots of jobs that are not affected by covering your face, e.g., telesales. Also, people covering their faces should not be allowed in certain places, such as banks and anywhere where security is paramount. This goes for anyone covering their faces, such as, helmets, hoodies, veils etc. So it is down to choice, but accept the consquences that go with that choice.
 

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I dont want to sound racist (and thats the biggest problem when you start discussing these issues, you get called racist if you dont agree with "their" views) but I personally think the school should be given a massive pat on the back in this day and age of bowing down to every minority in the UK.

I understand she didnt wear the veil in her interview, and has only started wearing it recently (when the school told her to remove it and intergrate). Whats really really really bugging me on this, is the amount of Muslims saying "this is not helping us intergrate" - I really wanna stand up to them and say "tell you what mate, this country has accepted you and your faith but we have OUR ways as British Citizens, and if you wish to stay you do as we do.

When Brits go to Dubai, we are told not to wear too revealing clothes apart from on the beach - the woman are asked to cover their shoulders and legs - and on the most part, tourists do! Its called respect, respect to the nation we are visiting. Now if you move there, you dont start disrepecting that nations beliefs do you - no of course you dont! You live with them, its probably part of the reason you moved their.

The biggest problem in Britain now is we have for far too long given too much away, our soverigty and our way of life, to help a mulit racial society develop together. In other words, we will have to change to make everybody welcome, and if you dont like it - your racist!

Because this is all to do with religion I dont see how people can call the racist card - its rubbish.

TRouble is, this arguement has to sides, and Ive listened to both - If this teacher was working in a Muslim school then of course she can wear her veil. She wasnt, so cant - end of!
 

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I think the whole saga is disgraceful.

This is Britain. Without meaning to sound racist, why can't these people be TOLD that they live by English rules, laws and traditions, or get out if they dont like it. Instead we tip toe round such people, pandering to their needs, rather than knocking the problem on the head once and for all with a hard line approach.

Once again, this country has bent over backwards to successfully accomodate, integrate and associate with the Muslim religion, whilst it seems a minority are not prepared to make a single sacrifice in return, much to the annoyance of those who are proud to be British Muslims, plus everyone else.

Given the terrorism concerns again the Muslim faith currently in this country, you would have thought that perhaps it might be an idea to try and calm any pressure or anger towards the faith rather than accentuate it??

I would not let my child (if I had one) be taught by someone in a veil. It does cause a barrier, even more so for children who are not aware of different faiths and their customs, and why they are dressed in such a manner. I could see how it would be frightening to a child.

We live in a country where everyone should be seen. A country where CCTV is there for a reason, where big brother, the authorities, the police etc have a right to see your face. I would not be happy if I was in a room/on a plane with a lady in a veil whom I couldn't see her expressions. A hoodie could be told to remove a hood, but why not a Muslim?

I'm fed up with reading about it. The woman who refused to take it off in a Post Office, despite being told she had to for the camera. The woman with a cross at BA who was suspended for wearing her cross on her necklace becuase it may offend other religions, when no doubt she has colleagues who follow the traditions of their religion such as veils or head wear ie Turbans etc. They are not told to do the same...The woman who was not challenged by customs to show her face against her passport. In an era of terrorism that is unforgiveable....

I think MPs, and Blair, were right to make their point. But they need to act on it and law down the rules.

Her case has been dropped. Another waste of tax payers money, another person who has upset the majority of Muslims by being so petty, and probably another wedge in the gap between culture seperation, as well as heightening racial tensions...

Not only that, but she still gets £1100 for her trouble. For what?

Once again, something needs to be done, or it will be another victory for lunacy, another loss for common sense, and another nail in the coffin for this society.
 

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Its a good thing that people are finally expressing how they feel towards the whole issue of integration, my only concern is that it is too little too late...

I remember reading a letter in "The Metro" which was in response to an article about the removal of Father Christmas from Shopping Centres and "Piglet" toys from receptions of doctors surgeries because they offended some peoples beliefs...

This letter (IIRC from a women) stated that they had no problem removing the items which caused offence as long as Halal meat was taken off of shelves in shops and Women did not wear their veils in public as this caused the writer offence...

This situation is only going to get worse and it has been a long time coming, the only thing we can do is as individuals live and let live....

The women in question was a teaching assistant NOT a teacher... there is a huge difference in the jobs they do
 

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And like Coolcurly Pt 2 and I both said, "I dont want to sound racist"

We find ourselves putting this disclaimer in everytime the subject is broached. And i'm fed up with tip toeing around what I am trying to say for fear of upsetting someone or being branded a racist.

It would be impossible to have a debate with this woman without being branded racist, insensitive or ignorant wouldn't it. Its that good 'ol racism card again...

Banning XMAS trees, lights, celebrations etc becuase it offends someone. Madness. Political correctness gone mad, well and truly. Well maybe a woman in a veil whose face I cant see offends and intimidates me. But as a Brit, in Britain, would I have a valid point if I cried to the papers/police/my employers about it??
 

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What amazes me about Muslim men & their views regarding women is that when ever you go in a Muslim Newsagents, have you seen how over loaded the "topshelf" material is ?

Also, if this Religion is so "PEACEFUL", why when anybody say a word out of line are they rioting in the streets & burning flags etc ?

I agree that she shouldnt be wearing it in the class room, you not only hear a persons voice when they speak, but you read their facial expresions too

Also, as a matter of national security at Passport control they should have to show their face, who's to say it isnt a man under that outfit ready to kill people ???

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This is Britain. Without meaning to sound racist, why can't these people be TOLD that they live by English rules, laws and traditions, or get out if they dont like it.
Spot the mistake above.

The command to wear the veil is found in both the Quran and Bible. However, the reason for the command is different when you compare the two books.

Quran says...

Surah 33:59 "Prophet! Tell thy wives and thy daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks close round them (when they go abroad). That will be better, so that they may be recognized and not annoyed. Allah is ever Forgiving, Merciful."

So the Quran says that women should wear the veil so that they can be recognized (as pious Muslim women) and then no one would bother flirting or annoying them. There are other reasons given in Hadith but I am just showing the Quran.

The Bible says...

Corinthians 11:3-12 "Now I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God. Every man who prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head. And every woman who prays or prophesies with her head uncovered dishonors her head-it is just as though her head were shaved. If a woman does not cover her head, she should have her hair cut off; and if it is a disgrace for a woman to have her hair cut or shaved off, she should cover her head. A man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man. For man did not come from woman, but woman from man; neither was man created for woman, but woman for man. 0For this reason, and because of the angels the woman ought to have a sign of authority on her head"

So we see that since the man is the glory of God and the woman is the glory of man then she has to wear the veil as a sign of authority. Her wearing the veil shows that she is subjected in authority to the man. Power authority, i.e. the sign of the husband's authority.

Put all that in to a 21st century Britain where there is equal rights, freedom of choice etc etc. Spot the irony. We are way to soft here.
 

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Interesting read, but Im not religous enough to really care about it - But I agree with your conclusion mate - The British Goverment has been WAY to soft for WAY too long - its time for a radical change not only to the way we are expected to intergrate with other religions and cultures but also how they intergrate with us. Also, we need to shut up shop on people entering the country until we have sorted out the mess this place is in. If that means leaving the EU, then good! What has the EU ever done for me to make my life better? Nothing directly!

I did go to a Church of England School and understand most of the bible - but my own person view is that every world war has been started over religion in some way or another. So the part in the bible that says "love thy neighbour" shows you how hypicrital it is. And the same flaws are in the Jewish version (cant remember what its called) and from my limited understanding, the Koran is the same.

What this woman has to realise is this - If a woman was working as a class room assistant and started to wear extremely short skirts and low cut crop tops she would be asked not to as they were deemed unacceptable to be worn in that enviroment. Same goes from the veil!

Now, if she wanted to wear a Red outfit that would be cool - means the kids could pretend she was a talking letter box!!
 

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What this woman has to realise is this - If a woman was working as a class room assistant and started to wear extremely short skirts and low cut crop tops she would be asked not to as they were deemed unacceptable to be worn in that enviroment. Same goes from the veil!
Very good point made there

Now, if she wanted to wear a Red outfit that would be cool - means the kids could pretend she was a talking letter box!!
And this did make me laugh.... reminded me of when i moved to East London a few years ago and a visiting friend asked me what the women in the area where like?

My response: "They have nice eyes"
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I think it's good it was challenged.

The case has not been dropped though, this is why I posted this, it's going to the high court. She lost her case in the norml courts so is taking it to the high court. Where shes getting funds from I don't have a clue.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
By the way, don't want this topic to get what some people call 'racist'. The dubai thing was a good example. There are certain dress codes and I certainly would get the sack if I walked into work every day wearing a t-shirt with holes in it and shorts. I'd get warned, and then if I didnt do soemthing, sacked. Just the same as the vale.
 

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Lets all get one thing straight - THIS POST IS NOT A RACIST POST - its discussing something that every man woman and child in this country is aware of and so far Ive not spoken to one person, from all backgrounds, who actually agrees with this damm woman - so the point also is - who the hell is supporting her claim to go to the high court!

She is obviously getting more and more publicity over this as we are all talkign about it - I just hope the press see sense and write her off as a timewasting waste of space - anybody know if this woman is British Born Muslim, or someone who has entered? Just curious..
 

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Our thanks go out to our brother Bishop DJHorace for that reading [:p]
I just think the irony around it all is laughable and it becomes clear to see when you read such material.

Seeing Muslim women in veils doing press conferences stating their rights in the UK, a country that gives them equal rights to men and every other person, and the right to choose whether or not to wear a symbol of clothing which brands them as less than equal in their own culture/relgion, is very ironic.

Further, for extreme Muslims like the ones that wear the veil, why are the women doing the press conference when their religion says women should be subjected to authority of men? In other words, why are the Muslim men not doing the press conference?

It is all so ridiculous, very satirical and absolute proof of the shambles we have let the country get in to. The recent efforts from our Government are too little too late. There will be religious fighting here in the UK very soon. The timer on the verbal and physical bombs will no doubt have been literally re-started by all this.

Also, its too late now, but stricter rules should have been laid down when these people came to this country just as we would have if we went to their historical countries of origin.
 

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I've made my feelings know before. This is an Anglo Saxon Christian country.

If this country is not to someones liking, for whatever reason then should go elswhere, in other words Fit In or F*** Off.

And it's not about race, or the colour of someone's skin, it's about attitude and behaviour.
 

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And it's not about race, or the colour of someone's skin, it's about attitude and behavior.
Here, Here. The problem is this country has gone so far down the wrong path so to speak, is there anything we can do, bar mass riots? (Which i fear is prob the only thing left to make the government realize we are all sick of them, hey it works in France)
 

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I cannot believe that no one within the Muslim community here in the UK has pulled her to one side, and not advise her to knock it on the head, but told her to. She is making a farce of all their efforts to integrate, assetain and maintain good relationships in multi ethnic communities...

As above, this will no doubt in turn fuel racist attacks. And guess who will be blamed for that...
 
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