Guys got a problem with the motor, being GT TDI 110, after starting it from cold, about 5 mins into the journey, it cuts out, the oil light comes on with a beep first and then all power is lost. It then takes about 4 attempts to get it started again. Any ideas.
TDI Cutting out
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
Guys just spoken to the previous owner who reckons it may be cos the car ran out of diesel a few weeks ago, and therefore the system may have air trapped. Which should clear itself. What do you guys think, a plausible expalnation.
I've had a *similar* problem to this, and there's one check you need to do to tell if it's the same problem -
When trying to restart, does the glowplug light come on?
If it DOESN'T, replace relay 109.
My problem was that if the car was run for a few minutes then stopped, it wouldn't restart. However, I didn't have the oil light coming on!
A good source of info for this is the US site tdiclub.com - that's where I learned about the relay 109 problem, while VW dealer could only say "It doesn't show us a fault code", which of course means they can't fix it!
Read here -
http://www.tdiclub.com/TDIFAQ/TDiFAQ-8.html#c
As to the air in the system theory, it *could* be -
- an air leak into the fuel line (check for loads of bubbles in the clear line to the injector pump. Some is OK, though)
- running it dry has dragged a load of dirt up the lines and clogged the fuel pump. also worth draining the fuel pump, in case it's full of water - often missed at service time.
The bosch injector pump on these engines is self-priming, and recirculates fuel back to the tank constantly - unless there's an air leak or blockage, it should sort itself out in a matter of minutes, and shouldn't recur.
My money's on relay 109 though - a sub-?20 part from VW.
PPS - If you can solder, you can fix it for 2p! Pop the relay open, and resolder all the joints.
When trying to restart, does the glowplug light come on?
If it DOESN'T, replace relay 109.
My problem was that if the car was run for a few minutes then stopped, it wouldn't restart. However, I didn't have the oil light coming on!
A good source of info for this is the US site tdiclub.com - that's where I learned about the relay 109 problem, while VW dealer could only say "It doesn't show us a fault code", which of course means they can't fix it!
Read here -
http://www.tdiclub.com/TDIFAQ/TDiFAQ-8.html#c
As to the air in the system theory, it *could* be -
- an air leak into the fuel line (check for loads of bubbles in the clear line to the injector pump. Some is OK, though)
- running it dry has dragged a load of dirt up the lines and clogged the fuel pump. also worth draining the fuel pump, in case it's full of water - often missed at service time.
The bosch injector pump on these engines is self-priming, and recirculates fuel back to the tank constantly - unless there's an air leak or blockage, it should sort itself out in a matter of minutes, and shouldn't recur.
My money's on relay 109 though - a sub-?20 part from VW.
PPS - If you can solder, you can fix it for 2p! Pop the relay open, and resolder all the joints.
Oh, meant to say that if you've just bought it, that's probably why it's been sold! It doesn't throw fault codes, and VW don't appear to know about the problem with their cr*ppy hungarian relays...
also, meant to say "clogged the fuel FILTER", not pump!
Just fixed the same problem on my wife's GT TDI 110 it's a common problem, power relay 109.
As shtu as posted if the glow plug light don't come on when you turn the key it wont start, it will only restart when the light is back on. It gives no fault codes so VW can't or wont find it.
Change that stupid relay before it gets you into trouble ours was so unpredictable, sometimes just missing a beat and carrying on then the worst.. dying completely[xx(] in the outside lane @70mph scares the crap out of you[:O]....no power brakes or steering.
hardest part is getting behind dash
As shtu as posted if the glow plug light don't come on when you turn the key it wont start, it will only restart when the light is back on. It gives no fault codes so VW can't or wont find it.
Change that stupid relay before it gets you into trouble ours was so unpredictable, sometimes just missing a beat and carrying on then the worst.. dying completely[xx(] in the outside lane @70mph scares the crap out of you[:O]....no power brakes or steering.
hardest part is getting behind dash
Cheers guys invaluable, especially Shtu for the in depth reply, I'll keep a lookout for the glow plug light the next time it cuts out. Hopefully there won't be one, so I can just slap on a 109 Power Relay.
RedBeard the exact thing happened to me the other day, was on a busy fast roundabout and it just cut out, power loss to steerin & brakes, quite scary, I managed to coast it to the side of the road with cars swerving right round me.
RedBeard the exact thing happened to me the other day, was on a busy fast roundabout and it just cut out, power loss to steerin & brakes, quite scary, I managed to coast it to the side of the road with cars swerving right round me.
Scary or what....
yep when it stops get safe, turn the key off then back on if no glow plug light turn off again, wait and try again soon as that light is on it will restart.
The oil light comes on and you get the buzzer cos the engine is dead.
It's shows no faults cos it thinks you've turn it off
yep when it stops get safe, turn the key off then back on if no glow plug light turn off again, wait and try again soon as that light is on it will restart.
The oil light comes on and you get the buzzer cos the engine is dead.
It's shows no faults cos it thinks you've turn it off
Guys if the glow plug light does come on is it still worth replacing anyway. Cos I think it did come on.
Also where is the relay located?
Also where is the relay located?
In our case the glow plug light would just flash as it faults them went out,the car would only restart when it came back on with the ignition and that varied in how long it took, sometimes seconds others a couple of minuits.
Mine was on the relay panel behind the dash.
Mine was on the relay panel behind the dash.
Quote: posted by Redbeard7 on 13/01/2005 17:00:24
In our case the glow plug light would just flash as it faults them went out,the car would only restart when it came back on with the ignition and that varied in how long it took, sometimes seconds others a couple of minuits.
Mine was on the relay panel behind the dash.
glad that sorted it for you
In our case the glow plug light would just flash as it faults them went out,the car would only restart when it came back on with the ignition and that varied in how long it took, sometimes seconds others a couple of minuits.
Mine was on the relay panel behind the dash.
glad that sorted it for you
Just out of interest guys, could this happen in a PD130?
yes it can happen on any TDI
it only costs about ?12
it only costs about ?12
Guys picked up one fron VW yesterday evening for ?12.75, just need to fit it now. Can anyone tell me exactly where it is. Cheers
Yep, no bother.
If you have small hands, you can get away with pulling out the horizontal panel above the pedals - pushes towards the bulkhead IIRC.
From here, you can reach up into the area to the acc. pedal side, and you will find the relay board.
You can also remove the lower RHS of the dash panel, couple of torx screws and out it comes. Easy to find from there - it the one with "109" on!
From the other details you've given, random stalling, etc, it does sound like the culprit. Now that I think about it again, mine did also have a couple of "blips" to the engine while lukewarm as well as the non-restart, but only a couple in a year or so. Three visits to VW couldn't find the problem. Surprised? Thought not.
PS - Funnily enough, this is a problem that used to affect the old 1.8i Cavaliers, 2.0i Opel Mantas and suchlike. They had a relay under the bonnet that controlled power to the injection system, which fails depressingly often.
If you have small hands, you can get away with pulling out the horizontal panel above the pedals - pushes towards the bulkhead IIRC.
From here, you can reach up into the area to the acc. pedal side, and you will find the relay board.
You can also remove the lower RHS of the dash panel, couple of torx screws and out it comes. Easy to find from there - it the one with "109" on!
From the other details you've given, random stalling, etc, it does sound like the culprit. Now that I think about it again, mine did also have a couple of "blips" to the engine while lukewarm as well as the non-restart, but only a couple in a year or so. Three visits to VW couldn't find the problem. Surprised? Thought not.
PS - Funnily enough, this is a problem that used to affect the old 1.8i Cavaliers, 2.0i Opel Mantas and suchlike. They had a relay under the bonnet that controlled power to the injection system, which fails depressingly often.
Thanks for that Shtu, I take a print of that and Give it a go over the weekend.
Talking about the vauxhalls, the golf is replacing a astra GTE which is gettin a little old. And yes your completely right in saying they had a similar problem, being the Ignition control relay situated in the engine bay. In the 6 years I owned the car I had to replace it twice for the car not starting.
Hopefully this should solve the problem, fingers crossed, as its not a nice feeling having just got the car to find it cutting out dangerously with no apparent reason, kinda takes away that reassurance you want with buying a newer car.
Talking about the vauxhalls, the golf is replacing a astra GTE which is gettin a little old. And yes your completely right in saying they had a similar problem, being the Ignition control relay situated in the engine bay. In the 6 years I owned the car I had to replace it twice for the car not starting.
Hopefully this should solve the problem, fingers crossed, as its not a nice feeling having just got the car to find it cutting out dangerously with no apparent reason, kinda takes away that reassurance you want with buying a newer car.
Cheers guys gave the relay change a go over the weekend and was not hard at all, running well for now fingers crossed, hasn't cut out as of yet. Cheers all.
Is here a part no?
Don't have this problem but for ?12 & it being not uncommon, I might like to have it to hand.
Don't have this problem but for ?12 & it being not uncommon, I might like to have it to hand.
Just go into the dealers and ask for Relay 109. ?12.75 and thats it.
Cheers!
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
- This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Volkswagen Mark IV Forum
A forum community dedicated to Volkswagen Mark 4 owners and enthusiasts in the UK. Come join the discussion about performance, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more for the Golf, Bora, Jetta, Touran, and Scirocco!
Full Forum Listing
Recommended Communities
Join now to ask and comment!
