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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Fancied a big turbo on the Toledo, but while the heart says yes, the head is saying no. After watching a programme about rally cars recently, it made me think about buying my own car and building it up slowly and using it for track days and similar.

If I did it, the considerations would be;

1) Turbo engine

2) Reasonably cheap to buy

3) Easy to tune

4) Easy to repair and access to spares

5) Four wheel drive

The two that jumps out immediately to me is a Sierra Sapphire RS Cosworth 4x4 (I know the one here is 2wd)

or a Subaru Impreza Turbo/WRX/STi like these

The engine would be re-built come time with uprated parts and bigger turbo and it would not be a daily runner so that would be a consideration too.

Any other ideas?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for the feedback lads.

I had thought about a Supra, but they are rear drive. Having said that they have a huge tuning potential. The Celica is another option, although parts are less plentiful for them. An early Evo was also a consideration and like the Subaru, there are loads of them about now which means good access to tuning and parts. Skylines are too big, but an R32 GTR would be nice if the price was right.

Vauxhalls and the Sunny/Pulsar will not be a consideration as they have soft engines and weaknesses with the transmission. I know a couple of lads that have gone down the Nissan and Vauxhall path in the past, and it was not a good one.

I believe it is possible to bless an early Evo with a late Evo engine and transmission which is worth thinking about too......
 

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Honda Integra (DC5) R, 200+bhp, lsd fitted as std. If you do a search on the 'trader you'll find a few in Scotland. I nearly bought one the other day!

It's a shame this car isn't officially sold in the UK, as it's much better than the CTR.

And better built than an evo.
 

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4WD ya puff. Get yourself an Elise with a VAG 1.8T engine in. Will provide plenty of smiles per miles and eat a lot of other track cars for breakfast.
 

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What about an MX5 Turbo?  Im pretty sure you could get some decent power out of one of them and you get some rear wheel drift action in a small, light car.  I recon it would be plenty of fun and might be pretty good too!
 

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I know you may laugh but.........What about a Daihatsu Charade GTTi??

They are extremely cheap to buy, cheap to tune, weigh next to nothing & according to the 5th Gear programme, they would make an excellent rally car.

Unfortunately they are not 4x4.

I think theres one on ebay selling for 99p!
 

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Its not four wheel drive, but a Z-cars mini will see you as one of the fastest around every corner on a track, if not THE fastest.... Check out the website:

Clicky

You can do them yourself, i.e. buy the conversion kit etc. etc. and mini parts are cheap + easy to replace on the whole! Wicked fun [Y]
 

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Sierra Cosworth for cheap tuneability, upgrades and simplicity to work on :)

Plenty of advice out there, tuning companies and parts source is plentiful.

If it were me, somethnig like a caterham, westfield, the only thing thats stopped me personally gonig in this direction is the large population of upper class, more money than sense, cretins that are present in the kit car circles. O.k its RWD, but they dont half move, its like strapping an engine to a sheet of tinfoil.
 

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If it were me, somethnig like a caterham, westfield, the only thing thats stopped me personally gonig in this direction is the large population of upper class, more money than sense, cretins that are present in the kit car circles. O.k its RWD, but they dont half move, its like strapping an engine to a sheet of tinfoil.
don't let that stop you. My brother had a Caterham for a while and took it to several track days without problems. He said it was the most fun and agile car he had ever driven and from the times he took me out I can only agree. I think it can out-perform a lot of high performance cars with 4WD on the track because of it lightness and set-up but top end is obviously where it loses out. He went for a second hand Caterham approved one, seemed to be a reliable and fairly cheap rocket, and because it's a kit-car you can tinker about with it relatively easily. In the end he sold it and bought an 1980s Carrera RS only because he wanted the comfort factor when he drives to Le Mans every year.
 

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Its not four wheel drive, but a Z-cars mini will see you as one of the fastest around every corner on a track, if not THE fastest.... Check out the website:

Clicky

You can do them yourself, i.e. buy the conversion kit etc. etc. and mini parts are cheap + easy to replace on the whole! Wicked fun [Y]
Was just about to suggest exactly the same car - but Ive been looking into these for about a year now, and trust me you wont get much change out of ?15,000 if you want it done properly! Specially if you are going to go Turbo Hyuabussa route (and why not).

There is a good forum here for more advise though if you wanna look into it - http://www.theminiforum.co.uk/forums/index.php?act=idx - look for the Z Car garage down the list.

205GTI is a great little track car, as is a well set up R5 Turbo but the gearboxes are known to be a weak point on these.

I had a Vauxhall Shove-it (Chevette) HSR track car which I used alot for a year with my local motorclub. Great fun, but started costing too much money. Great car, twin 48's, straight cut ZF "slam" Box, adjustable everything, no speedo, just one mother of all Rev counters, oil temp/pressure and water temp.......push start, multipoint full FIA roll cage the lot - trouble was, because of the engine I was classed with the big V8's and turbo's. Once at brands I had a great 6 lapper with a Red Aston Martin Race car - he was canning me on the straights but as soon as we hit a bend I shot through the inside outbreaking him. When we both pulled into the pits we had a right laugh about it (bloke must have been in his 60s and I remember was an ex-AM mechanic).

Its a great thing to get into, but make sure you have a pot of money as you WILL want to get competitive. Local garages are always good, as are specialist car part suppliers.
 

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BigI you got the nail on the head mate.

I have a smart MX5 as a daily driver (at least it was before I put it in the tire wall at Coombe!) as you can see from my sig pic. It handles unbelievably well and is definitely the best handling car I have ever driven. Don't mistake handling for grip mind. What I mean is its driftable, chuckable, easily fetched back from a slide, just so controllable on the limit its untrue. I however went into Avon Rise on a drying circuit a little too quick and lost the back end - schoolboy driver error!

Its 140ish brake as standard but there is a big tuning scene for turbos and superchargers which I had no idea about unitl I joined the MX5 forum. Either FI route can bring 200bhp+ and around 6 seconds 0-60. I believe that level of tuning will cost you ?2k ish, when you can consider you can buy a decent Mk1 MX5 for ?1500 thats pretty cheap to get Boxster eating capability. Now I have the MX5 I don't think I'll ever sell it, it will become my 2nd car for weekends and holidays and fun when I have the need to get something more sensible again. Its that good a car.
 

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If its going to be for trackdays and the occasional weekend jaunt, does it have to be practical and confortable.

Thats sort of money will buy a nice Caterham/Westfield. Grin factor will be ten times any mad Supra...

Persoanlly, i'd start cheaper, rather than straight into serious and pricey stuff

Honda CRX? Pug 205GTI 1.9? Both could be had, prepared and insured for a year for less than 2k and will provide loads of cheap fun.

306GTi? MX5? Again, a little more money and still great drivers cars...

Who cares if it wont hold its own with Evos/Skylines. You will still have a huge amount of fun and learn alot in any of the above machinery...
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Never been a big fan of the 2 seater sports car like the caterhams and westfields. The rally reps are ideal due to their setup and tunability. If I could get a readily modified Fiesta 4x4 or Lupo with a Cosworth/S3 engine or similar, that would be even better!
 

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used to be into pugs, myself and built my own MI16..

whats your plan is it trackdays your after? or are you after getting into motorsport?

Trackdays while fun, can get a bit boring and competitiveness will kick in what are you aiming to do?

If I was you I would build a MI16 205 GTI, it could be done for less than ?1500 and 40 hours labour for you an a mate, the conversion is well documented and custom parts to make it easy are all over the web, also I remember when a 205 mi16 minced even a mighty Subaru round Anglesey's circuit, they are damn quick cars, and stripped out will weigh only 900kgs and have a power output of 160 BHP.

Alternatively if RWD is a must have, then have a think about e30 325i it will need a LSD diff and shedload of weight stripping out but could be fun and it can be upgraded with loads of parts cheaply from scrapped 5 series's
 

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I would also recommend the Pug 205GTi as a brilliant base for a track car I've helped build 3 of them so far. They are brilliant fun & will put a lot of bigger engined cars to shame. I never made one with a Mi16 engine but would expect it to be a brilliant bit of kit.
 
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