Volkswagen Mark IV Forum banner

1 - 20 of 29 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
90 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Just wondering if anyone has an opinion on N.Korea now in possession of and testing nuclear weapons.

i have only heard whats been on the tv and in papers, just wanted to see if anyone has any views on this.

i think ill be reading up, but its a country i dont really know much about.

Pan.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
878 Posts
I think if there was ever any evidence that the most recent Iraq war was started over oil, then this is it. We originally sent our men and women out to fight due to the "threat" of biological weapons that never appeared. Now North Korea, run by another egocentric despot, have shown nuclear capability, nothing is done. It makes me f***ing sick!

[:mad:]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,500 Posts
I take your point but the problem is that there really is no option for a military response against North Korea.Doing so would bring China into the equation and we'd all be in deep shoot. Not to mention that they have over a million soldiers waiting for an excuse to pour into south korea.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,198 Posts
I think if there was ever any evidence that the most recent Iraq war was started over oil, then this is it. We originally sent our men and women out to fight due to the "threat" of biological weapons that never appeared. Now North Korea, run by another egocentric despot, have shown nuclear capability, nothing is done. It makes me f***ing sick!

[:mad:]
As much as I agree the prime motive over Iraq probably was oil, North Korea is an entirely different proposition. The big issue is that they are sat next to the biggest army in the world in China, who are the closest North Korea has to an ally.

The initial reaction from China was promising though, I thought their statement was far more sensible than the US. The US, rather predictably, wasn't able to issue a statement without referring to military action.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
414 Posts
Well, it's not good is it?

The USA's position is not very strong, being overstretched with Iraq, Afghanistan, and everywhere else they are. I think they'll have to do some negotiating, but Kim Jong Il will know that the USA ain't going to send 10,000 troops over, and if they did what would happen? Another war we get dragged into because Mr [baby] Bush wants to keep all the toys to himself and his mates. Quite hypocritical saying you can't have a nuclear weapon, but I can. And why?? Because they're more responsible??? Give me a break!! I mean America acts like the world police! And who has nominated them for this role? And they wonder why most of the world hates them!

Looking at it from N. Korea's point of view, I can understand why they want nuclear capability. If you had a gun and I wanted to protect myself from you (i.e. not be bullied cos you got the gun and could push me around), I'd get a gun so that, if you shot me, I'd shoot you and we'd both be dead (in the timeframe of launching nuclear ICBM's). Knowing that with my gun, you won't shoot me cos you'll get shot too [lot of shots going about here [:p], I'd feel a lot more comfortable about you having one. This is MAD (mutually assured destruction) theory, when a nuke was fired at you, all you'd be able to do before it hit would be to launch one back. And it's this that has kept the world nuclear free since Nagasaki.

IMO nuclear weapons should be illegal under UN/international law or whatever, then the USA and others could credibly disarm states with nuclear weapons. We'd be back to conventional warfare, where manpower and firepower is the big indicator on military strength. BUT the USA will not give up it's nuclear arsenal and neither will Korea, so it's like who's going to drop their gun first?? No one. So we have to live with the fact that states will have nuclear weapons, but should Korea be allowed to keep it's nuclear capability, expect other states to attain nuclear status. Not good.

So where will we end up? Probably putting sanctions on the whole country, like Iraq in '90, screwing the general population who probably have nothing to do with it, sowing the seeds for more terrorism against the countries involved in sanctioning and possible military action. Then the whole cycle will start again with Iran/Syria and any other state which Bush happens not to like or has some valuble resource (most probably oil!!) within it's territorial boundaries!

Ah well, the way of the West.

P.S sorry for the long post, just got going, then looked up and [:eek:] lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
878 Posts
Granted NK is a very different proposition to Iraq, and each instance will be different from the last. I think this time the US will have to just sit and accept it. They can't really impose sanctions, as NK really doesn't have any international industrial or commercial clout. I just hope to God that lil' Kim is just flexing his muscles and never ever does anything stupid.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,735 Posts
I don't see what it has to do with us.  We are not threatened by them, they are not going all out for war.  They won't make a move on the South so why get involved.  It is not like we need their oil.  I don't see why we need to get involved at all.  If the people within the country don't like what is going on, then let them rise up and do something about it.  Why should we dictate what they can do?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,827 Posts
I don't see why we need to get involved at all. If the people within the country don't like what is going on, then let them rise up and do something about it.
The people live in fear of his regime and anyway they are so poor and reduced to living off the land like paupers. Contrast that to south korea which is completely the opposite end of the spectrum. Reminds me of Zimbabwe and Mugabe !
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,149 Posts
It is a problem NK developing a nuclear arsenal, but only as it is a problem with America having a nuclear arsenal and China, UK, India, Pakistan, etc etc... We would all be screwed if they fired one on South Korea, because then everyone gets dragged in, quite what the global response would be im not sure but you can bet that the US would be wanting to wade in and blow the crap out of them. Im not sure that they form part of the "axis of evil" but you can just here it in Bush's voice the man is clearly bonkers, you can imagine him saying to his number 2,

No 2: "what are we going to do today?" Bush:"Samething we do everyday, Try to take over the world" (Pinky and the Brain stylee)

Seriously though the man is a war mongering, ego-manic who seems hell bent on taking over the world, NK only really sucks because they are a bunch of millitant hard line commy' gits.!

Its a loose, loose situation, we cant force them to give up their nuclear right, and yet by imposing sanctions on them, we alienate the people and cause them more suffering, and there is no way that they could revolt and cause an uprising, the military would crush that, im sure that the people probably live in fear.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,528 Posts
I don't see what it has to do with us. We are not threatened by them, they are not going all out for war. They won't make a move on the South so why get involved. It is not like we need their oil. I don't see why we need to get involved at all. If the people within the country don't like what is going on, then let them rise up and do something about it. Why should we dictate what they can do?
This is a nightmare... even the Russians and the Chinese are gutted.. the reason being is that PyongYang will sell there arms on to anyone, they are renowned for it, there will not and could not be a war in this region as Seoul and Beijing are too close IE in striking distance this is why there will be no action.

Believe me Rogue states that dont oblige by international law or pressure are our worst nightmare.... what if PyongYang sold a Nuke Briefcase Bomb to Al Quaeda? would we know ? ... this is fatal.

To those who say well we usa/russia/india etc have got it... well I am sorry but we act responsible (relatively) and can be controlled by outside factors such as the UN and NATO or the COmmon Wealth....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,528 Posts
I don't see what it has to do with us. We are not threatened by them, they are not going all out for war. They won't make a move on the South so why get involved. It is not like we need their oil. I don't see why we need to get involved at all. If the people within the country don't like what is going on, then let them rise up and do something about it. Why should we dictate what they can do?
This is a nightmare... even the Russians and the Chinese are gutted.. the reason being is that PyongYang will sell there arms on to anyone, they are renowned for it, there will not and could not be a war in this region as Seoul and Beijing are too close IE in striking distance this is why there will be no action.

Believe me Rogue states that dont oblige by international law or pressure are our worst nightmare.... what if PyongYang sold a Nuke Briefcase Bomb to Al Quaeda? would we know ? ... this is fatal.

To those who say well we usa/russia/india etc have got it... well I am sorry but we act responsible (relatively) and can be controlled by outside factors such as the UN and NATO or the COmmon Wealth.... or even OPEC as we rely on imports and exports... NK let 3million people starve 4 years ago rather than accept outside help.. thats 3 million out of 24 million .. that would be like the brits letting 6 million people die rather than accept Aid
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,934 Posts
Well, it's not good is it?

The USA's position is not very strong, being overstretched with Iraq, Afghanistan, and everywhere else they are. I think they'll have to do some negotiating, but Kim Jong Il will know that the USA ain't going to send 10,000 troops over, and if they did what would happen? Another war we get dragged into because Mr [baby] Bush wants to keep all the toys to himself and his mates. Quite hypocritical saying you can't have a nuclear weapon, but I can. And why?? Because they're more responsible??? Give me a break!! I mean America acts like the world police! And who has nominated them for this role? And they wonder why most of the world hates them!

Looking at it from N. Korea's point of view, I can understand why they want nuclear capability. If you had a gun and I wanted to protect myself from you (i.e. not be bullied cos you got the gun and could push me around), I'd get a gun so that, if you shot me, I'd shoot you and we'd both be dead (in the timeframe of launching nuclear ICBM's). Knowing that with my gun, you won't shoot me cos you'll get shot too [lot of shots going about here [:p], I'd feel a lot more comfortable about you having one. This is MAD (mutually assured destruction) theory, when a nuke was fired at you, all you'd be able to do before it hit would be to launch one back. And it's this that has kept the world nuclear free since Nagasaki.

IMO nuclear weapons should be illegal under UN/international law or whatever, then the USA and others could credibly disarm states with nuclear weapons. We'd be back to conventional warfare, where manpower and firepower is the big indicator on military strength. BUT the USA will not give up it's nuclear arsenal and neither will Korea, so it's like who's going to drop their gun first?? No one. So we have to live with the fact that states will have nuclear weapons, but should Korea be allowed to keep it's nuclear capability, expect other states to attain nuclear status. Not good.

So where will we end up? Probably putting sanctions on the whole country, like Iraq in '90, screwing the general population who probably have nothing to do with it, sowing the seeds for more terrorism against the countries involved in sanctioning and possible military action. Then the whole cycle will start again with Iran/Syria and any other state which Bush happens not to like or has some valuble resource (most probably oil!!) within it's territorial boundaries!

Ah well, the way of the West.

P.S sorry for the long post, just got going, then looked up and [:eek:] lol
Excellent post. Totally agree [y]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
674 Posts
As I work for a Korean firm, Ive had very long educational chats with my collegues from South Korea.

I was very suprised to hear that many South Korean companies give MASSIVE amounts of money to the North Koreans due to the poverty the North Koreans live with. Ive been told that the difference is totally unbelievable and most South Koreans would prefer ONE nation. The reason for the "charity"donations is partly to secure any business should the south ever be allowed to trade with the North..

I think the Chinese stand on this is the most important thing to watch. Dont worry about Bush, he has all his irons in to many fires already but what does amaze me is the UN stating about bringing in more sanctions etc. They have had sanctions with NK for years and obviously hasnt worked.

China seem to be onside with the UN, and China are the biggest worry to the UN due to the size of the Army etc. But even Russia has condemed the test. But in a funny way I sort of agree with what was said above. US put North Korea on its list of Axis of Evil countrys, therefore showing that they "could" do the same as what they did in Afganistan. The way North Korea has defended any possible action is to explode a Nuclear Warhead underground to sort of show them "dont even think about it"... Remember alot of what we read about the NK is Westernised Media so some of it has to be taken with a pinch of salt. It will make that idiot Bush and his war chiefs thing twice about anything - and that can only be a good thing - even if North Korea does have a lot to answer for...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
857 Posts
BUT the USA will not give up it's nuclear arsenal and neither will Korea, so it's like who's going to drop their gun first?? No one. So we have to live with the fact that states will have nuclear weapons, but should Korea be allowed to keep it's nuclear capability, expect other states to attain nuclear status. Not good.
why does America think they run the planet? if they have nukes who are they to say others cant?

also lets say Korea does give up their nukes why do America need theirs?
 
1 - 20 of 29 Posts
Top