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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Some of you may know about the Choose & Book system which has been implemented across the UK, enabling the patient to book their hospital appointment there and then with their GP and choose the hospital of their choice.

Firstly I would like to ask anyone if they have used this system and what they thought about it. I.e. was it better for you as a patient than getting a letter from your hospital / GP advising you of your appointment time?

Secondly, if I told you it has cost ?12.9bn would you still be suitably impressed?

This was supposed to be a vote winner for labour. Thing is, that 12.9bn spent has caused an utter shambles in terms of IT in GP surgerys. Basically they 'forgot' to upgrade the bandwidths in surgeries, leaving most surgeries on 512k links (28.8 uplink) and expected all bookings to be done via the GP in surgery time. GP's have been crying out saying they can't do it, the system does not work, but all that happens is we get 'incentive' money taken from us.

Now, you may thin 'why not just upgrade the speeds'. Aha, the intelligent little boffins at NHS headquarters signed a deal with BT to provide N3 (an NHS network basically). How much does it cost to upgrade a surgery from 512k/1mb to what they are proposing (2mb). ?30,000 PER SURGERY!!!! BT weren't fools, NHS loses again.

So why am I going on about all this? Basically how much is the NHS in debt? Did this system, which is basically a vote winner really need to be implemented with OUR money. Could they not have wiped off 10bn debt and put the other 2.9bn into beds and staff?

This leads me onto, why the HELL are labour still in power in this country?! It's no wonder they are taxing us and fining us in every single way possible. Stealth taxes, council taxes going up a lot more than inflation year upon year.

I don't really take much notice of what they do, but be-jesus, 12.9m for a nationwide booking system?! Wouldnt mind so much if it worked, which it does, it just takes a GP 10 mins to make an appointment, of which he has to have seen, met, diagnosed and issued any medication, to a patient also at the same time, otherwise, again, he get's fined at the end of the year for making patients wait to long.

Basically, which party gives us a better choice? This time round I'm going to use my vote and it certainly won't be labour, of hich I think will be worse under Mr Brown.
 

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This is the way of politics, young Mr. Leadwelly. Vote for a party, get them in power, they stay in for 4 or 8 ( or more in this case ) years, we all get fed up with their stupid policies, we vote for another party, get them in power, and round and round it goes.

IMO, Labour have gone barmy - stealth taxes, here there and everywhere. And more too if the courts decide we can order booze and **** of the internet and have them delivered, duty free, to our door then they'll be more tax rises as Mr Brown loses out on ?16bn pa

We're all FUBAR'd
 

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My mum had to use this system the other day. She chose the day and hospital she wanted and off she went

Then she got a letter saying that it turns out the day she wanted was not actually available and they offered another day, which i'm sure is similar to how it used to work anyway!!
 

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They must sit down in meetings and plan how badly they can possibly balls up an initiative.

Once again, masses of overpaid goons in suits who think they know what they are doing, and genuinely think their decisions are positive.

And when it comes out, another 12 billion here and there wasted through incompetence, is anyone ever sacked, strung up, made to explain or publically named and shamed....

No, brushed under the carpet...dont let the public know how we are wasting their money, and there will be no upset people

If you or I made decisions in our jobs that made monumental cock ups like they do every day of the week, we would be sacked in no time. But because they have no 'owner' of the funding to explain themsleves to, only Dickhead Brown in charge of it, they have nothing to explain, so no worries.

Sorry boss, fucked up, shit decison, just lost you 12 billions pounds this quarter. Not to worry eh, plenty more where that came from, Gordon, get on the blower to fat front lady bottom 2 Jags and dream up another tax...

They genuinely cannot get their heads around the fact that it is easier to stop wasting money rather than earning it. Would you leave the windows open when you have the central heating on....
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I suppose that is the point. If they do lose money say in the NHS from a cock up, they can put petrol, council tax, stealth taxes up, get more safety people out on the roads, dream up congestion charging, hey, or why not just put intrest rates down stupid levels so everyone starts spending to get some more taxes from them.

I read that VAT is due to go up to 19% in the next couple of years, but can't remember if I read it on here or on another fourm / BBC. Imagine that, might not make THAT much difference to the average person, but 1.5p extra for nearly every single ?1 spent in the UK. Now thats huge sums of money.

Put that into perspective, it's another 60-80p for every single car fill up everyone does in the country. Another 75p for every single ?50 weekly shop in tescos etc etc.

Its basically nearly ?1 for every ?5 spent in the country. Now thats major money!!
 

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Booze and chuck as we call it, what a shamballs.

My other half was involved in this and got out as soon as she could, the government are ploughing lots of cash into this and getting no results. Everyone who I speak to about this says the same thing..... it's crap and should be pulled.

BTW Graham, all our sites have been 2mb for 5 or 6 years now and are going 10 meg soon [:)]
 

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Whats gets me is how the government seems to write blank cheques to many of the hairbrain scheme's it proposes.

If it had a tight arse yorkshire man like me working in cabinet... i would make sure that NON of these schemes were open to abuse.
?30'000 for a 1mb upgrade per surgery!!! Thats down right criminal.

Im sure there are alot of back handers and corruption when it comes to government spending in the UK... (and i think there has always been... just some governments are more corrupt than others)

Why does everything this government do in this country.... no matter how small.... always cost billions!!!

There are lots of people out their in the UK abusing the system.......including the government
 

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Bit off post .....If you were to buy your own island could you make up your own taxes, law's etc?? or would you still have to abide by the laws from where you bought the island from.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Booze and chuck as we call it, what a shamballs.

My other half was involved in this and got out as soon as she could, the government are ploughing lots of cash into this and getting no results. Everyone who I speak to about this says the same thing..... it's crap and should be pulled.

BTW Graham, all our sites have been 2mb for 5 or 6 years now and are going 10 meg soon [:)]
How many users is that serving? I'm currently using 512kb across 32 workstations. if the uplink was bigger than 28.8k it would help a hell of alot, as you know, with C&B were sending stuff to a server, so it's a complete nightmare.

Then they have the great of idea of electronic prescriptions, oh, can't wait for that one!

Trouble is, we then get it in the neck from patients.
 

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Booze and chuck as we call it, what a shamballs.

My other half was involved in this and got out as soon as she could, the government are ploughing lots of cash into this and getting no results. Everyone who I speak to about this says the same thing..... it's crap and should be pulled.

BTW Graham, all our sites have been 2mb for 5 or 6 years now and are going 10 meg soon [:)]
How many users is that serving? I'm currently using 512kb across 32 workstations. if the uplink was bigger than 28.8k it would help a hell of alot, as you know, with C&B were sending stuff to a server, so it's a complete nightmare.

Then they have the great of idea of electronic prescriptions, oh, can't wait for that one!

Trouble is, we then get it in the neck from patients.
Take it the booking system isn't web protocal based ? Problem with the NHS projects is a lot of people are contractors so no one has any ownership.
 

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No what i mean is .... why not implement an iternal booking system based on web protocals (ie something PHP/ASP based over SSL) which is only accessable via GPs on the N3 network. This would dramatically reduce bandwidth usage on the upward stream.

I take it the Tech Arcitects arn't the best on the NHS projects.... anyway I suppose it's not much use me saying the above as it's already in place.
 

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And who has access to all this centralised information...... MMMm

My dad has been the victim of identiy theft on his bank account 5 times... all inside jobs at said bank, like he said if these crims could co-ordinate this with an NHS insider or a revenue insider he would have been fubar, centralisation, IS not a great idea, if people can be dis-honest,
 

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its a shame that surgerys/hospitals don't operate the same way as schools

publicly funded but operate on their own

then if a particular surgery decided they need to use this new system they could then sort out the necessary upgrades rather than the government/us being stung because its all handled a million levels above where these places are just more opportunities to rip off the public
 

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Graham,

All 150 of our sites are 2mb, with between 4 - 40 workstations. Our new HQ and the old HQ (where all the servers are) has a 100mb link between the two [:)]

BTW, our GPs (and Network Support staff) can now "dial in" from home via any internet connection. We have a VPN concentrator which lets them authenticate, use clinical systems and see their data from home using a combo of their C&B smartcard and some other topsecret stuff [:p]
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
No what i mean is .... why not implement an iternal booking system based on web protocals (ie something PHP/ASP based over SSL) which is only accessable via GPs on the N3 network. This would dramatically reduce bandwidth usage on the upward stream.

I take it the Tech Arcitects arn't the best on the NHS projects.... anyway I suppose it's not much use me saying the above as it's already in place.
Thats pretty much what is is, web based booking system.

Carlos, hmm, seems your places got it ok then! All of the PCT down here (though not sure not its merged, at least all 52 sites) were put on 512k, were still on it.

I'm looking forward to centralised servers, electronic prescriptions, the electronic care record....rock on, be able to see one patient a day by the time all the electronic stuff for them has uploaded and downloaded!

Greenbeast...it used to be pretty much that way, we got given a budget, what we did with it was up to us. Now, it's all taken over from us and people like Carlos (I believe!!) come and install it for us.

Means if a printer dies, we have to call fujitsu, who then call the PCT IT Team, who then call the finance team who ok it, back to the IT team who then call us and then send an engineer out. The IT team cannot buy any equipment under the value of ?250 either. Another absolutely ridiculous 'money saving' idea. All the major companies have the NHS by the danglies.

Used to work this way, printer dies, I buy replacement and install.

Its real stupid. They have decided now that we all need to use genuine and original parts in printers and if caught using compatiables (which we have done for years especially toner) then we will be fined.

Good good, another ?10-20 a cartridge then!! Excellent. A year ago they were sending us leaflets on how to use recycled cartridges!!

The NHS seems to change every 2 years. Not so long ago we had heatlh authorities, then someone had the bright idea of taking these and splitting them into small chunks and calling them a PCG. Then someone else had the idea of clumping PCT's into groups and called them PCT's (Trusts instead of groups), now someone has had the completely original and stonking new idea or guess what.....merging them all back together again! Exactly the same as health autorities used to be! These people are on ?130-400k PER YEAR!
 

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Hi All,

I work for the NHS myself on a local helpdesk that supports the "Conecting for Health" (C4H) program. when you say that it has cost 12bn so far to impliment its not just choose and book that is being implimented, there is a whole new GP clinical system that is being put in place. the reason for the high price of the upgraded connection, N3 (which im sure iv heard only costs half of what has been outlined above) is that its a decicated network that is only accessable to the NHS and that is contracted to set uptimes. providing what would be a better service.

The new clinical system and the N3 connection means that GP records can be accessed faster at A&E, for example if you were on the otherside of the country and had to go to the GP or A&E then they will be able to retrieve your medical records within seconds rather than minutes or even hours. this could mean faster diagnostics of conditions and even prevent giving a drug that a patient is sensitive to.

all the above is what i have been told during training and what not. im not going to go into the politics but yes it has been expensive but would you rather the 12bn go to waste or carry on and have what is meant/could provide a better service from the NHS?

Anth

P.s sorry for any spelling mistakes!
 

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is that its a decicated network that is only accessable to the NHS and that is contracted to set uptimes. providing what would be a better service.
Yep, the cost of network connections ramp up significantly when SLAs start to tbe banded around.
 

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Dont talk to me about the Pennypinching Labour cronies and the NHS.

Get this. I work as a Paramedic in London. We used to work a 39 hr week but under EU law we now do 37.5 hr week. Because of our rota system we still do 39 hrs work and get paid for the hour and half each week. Nowbecause of NHS debt they're doing away with the 1.5hrs and giving us an uninteruptable 30 meal break instead. Thats right. You could be trapped in your car in agony right outside our station but we would'nt be activated because we're not being paid for it. We are far from amused. Not only are we out of pocket but people unfortunately WILL die as result. Imagine the Fire Brigade not attending you trapped in a house fire because their having their dinner? Thought not. Outrageous!
 
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