[Blue V5]

hey all, didn't know where i could post this so thought i'd try here!

who heel and toes successfully in their golf/bora? the pedals are very awkwardly spaced which means its more using each side of the foot and dangling off the brake pedal.

i'm finding it quite difficult at the mo and would appreciate any advice!

thanks []

 

[jblack]

I didn't think it was possible on a DBW car? Anyone care to confirm/deny this?

 

[Blue V5]

its not, but i don't have drive by wire []

 

[Gti Fly]

Just for the record, it IS possible to heal and toe on a DBW.

But to the topic,

I try and heal and toe, but it's bloody hard coming down from 3rd to 2nd. Matching the revs is a 'mare.

4th - 3rd is fine, and pretty seemless most of the time though.

Doesn't help that the R-pedals are so damn slippery anyway.

Tips - well try and wear the right footwear - I find loafers (the older
the better!) are good, as they are relatively soft and squidgy.

Try doing it in a straight line when practising. Don't H+T whilst cornering if you're practising - obvious reasons really.

Im sure there's lots of other great tips to come from the guys

 

[Royster]

I always heel n toe in the R. Well my method which involves left foot big toe braking and small toes blipping the throttle on the down change. Works remakably well and makes for slowing down much smoother. I have seen Jason Plato use this method on awkward positioned pedals so don't bother contorting your ankle through 90degrees![H][:S]

DBW only kills the throttle after a couple of seconds. more than enough time to blip!

 

[Blue V5]

thanks gti-fly, but do i have the method of using each side of the foot right? i.e left side braking and right side blipping the accelerator?

 

[Blue V5]

I always heel n toe in the R. Well my method which involves left foot big toe braking and small toes blipping the throttle on the down change. Works remakably well and makes for slowing down much smoother. I have seen Jason Plato use this method on awkward positioned pedals so don't bother contorting your ankle through 90degrees![H][:S]

DBW only kills the throttle after a couple of seconds. more than enough time to blip!

thanks royster. am i right in thinking that the pedals are set up better for this on the R than normal mk4's?

 

[Gti Fly]

I once attended a Ferrari driving day, and the instructor there was using Roy's preffered method -

Ie big toe/ball of foot on brake,

small toes to blip throttle.

The instructor was doing it very well indeed, and it was soo smooth to watch.

This method is indeed easier to apply, as your ankle/foot is more
naturally suited, BUT you can easily CRASH if you're not careful. If
you foot slips, you could end up applying as much throttle as braking
effort..... I've been there.. done that.. never again.
That's my warning anyway!

The proper way is obviously to use the ball of ur right foot on the
brake, and use ur heal to blip the throttle. It just takes lots
and lots of practise. The difficult part is being able to apply
maximum braking force, whilst simaltaneuously matching the engine revs
to the downchanges.

Hardwork, but when u get it right, it's sooooooooooo satisfying

 

[Blue V5]

i hear what your saying about all of the above and when downshifting off the motorway to the sliproad the other day i actually managed it and the gear change was super smooth, i was so impressed as i didn't have to bring the clutch up so slowly due to the revs being matched.

but i doubly take note about the crash thing, thats why i was wondering if my method was right as it seems very easy to slip off the brake.

the annoying thing with the bora is the accelerator is set so far back from the brake pedal. idealfor normal driving as its safer but not when you wanna drive properly []

 

[Gti Fly]

The throttle and brake positioning in the R32 is the same as other mrk4's.

I've watched that video of the R32 race (R32 vs Gta vs RX7 etc) over
and over where the driver is heal and toeing it all the way around the
track, and he somehow manages it

Ideally I'd love to go on one of those driving training courses to learn improve my driving

 

[Blue V5]

and me, i'm saving for one now!

i've just watched the vid i found on my hardrive called 'motegibattle' with an NSX, modena, CSL, murcielago, gallardo and carrera which has in car cams showing revs and drivers feet and the heel and toe'ing in that is well impressive.

 

[talk-torque]

Taught myself how to do this ages ago, while I had crap old cars that you had to double de-clutch down the gears. I do it all the time now, so I just had to go sit in the Golf to think about how. I place the ball of my foot on the brake pedal so that it's covering the right hand half of the pedal. On mine, when you push the brake, where it bites is just at the right hight to rock the foot over on the throttle and give it a blip. If you do it like that your foot is secure enough on the brake, even on the R32 pedals I've fitted to my 150PD, which can be a little slippy.

Try it at slow speed to start with - it's just the sequence of actions that you need to learn. It'll become second nature after a bit.

Yes, the DBW system lets you blip the throttle while braking, but full on left foot braking, a la rally driver technique, is a no no.

 

[Blue V5]

excellent, i shall be trying this in a bit []

 

[Royster]

Have fun! be safe![H]

Practice by blipping the gas without braking. Which I do whilst Motorway driving[8-|]

 

[tylerama]

Can someone confirm my thoughts on this please ?
I thought heel and toeing was only really needed if you had a straight cut 'box ? or were without synchromesh ? i.e. a race car ? I assume there are other benefits from it then ?

 

[Skii_]

Heel and toe was a technique used by racing drivers to get the very best performance out of a non-synchromesh gearbox in the days when it was necessary to match revs with the appropriate gear whilst braking for a corner. Drivers found they could marginally improve their breaking and downchanging efficiency thus shaving off seconds in laptimes.

Why anyone needs to employ this technique in a modern VW Golf with a syncromesh gearbox is hard to understand.

I'm not knocking anyone who does it, but I do wonder why !

 

[talk-torque]

There is no need to do it, but changing down with a blip of the throttle, so that the gears are properly matched, results in an almost seamless change, which, as said before, is very satisfying. A Ferrari paddle switch gearbox puts in a blip, so if it's good enough for them etc. Anyway - I do it 'cos I can can can!

 

[nrgizerbunny]

Why anyone needs to employ this technique in a modern VW Golf with a syncromesh gearbox is hard to understand.

I'm not knocking anyone who does it, but I do wonder why !

if you double declutch or heel toe, you match the engine revs to the
road revs. this will cause reduced wear on the synro and more over on
the clutch.

also means if you do it correctly you'll be in the right gear when you come out of a corner - saving valuable seconds

 

[MRK IV]

"saving valuable seconds"

....on the commute to work?

 

[binlinerVR6]

A Ferrari paddle switch gearbox puts in a blip, so if it's good enough for them etc.

so does the one in the MkV Golf